After IV
BONUS EPISODE: Hon Eng & Be a Sozo not a Bozo

Musical Interlude

Interview

Jon Steele  0:05  
I think about some of the some of the mental transitions that happened for me even as I progressed through my program when I was in grad school. And that's that when I've even just from one semester to the next that, you know, second semester, I would look back on first semester and remember the lamenting that I did a first semester of like, oh my gosh, this is so hard. And then he gets a second semester. You're like, Oh, John, one semester ago, you didn't know what you were talking about. about it being hard that you have these like your perspective shifts, even as you get deeper into your program. So I'm wondering, are there also shifts that happen here, like you've said, primary calling that stays the same? But are there further adjustments that are required for grad students in their ongoing faith development, even as they progress through their program and some of that rigor changes or as their focus continues to narrow? Yeah. Are there any changes that happened during those those times? 

Hon Eng  1:02  
Yeah. I find it interesting. Over the years, when some grad students have had a hard time with a program, they come to me and say, “I'm thinking about going to seminary.” Yeah, Greek and Hebrew was a piece of cake... So you know, I, I tried to remind them that I call it the ministry of sozo it's another Greek word worth learning. The Greek word, S-O-Z-O is a fun sounding word. So I like that translated save or rescue or made whole made well. The noun is soteria, which is translated as salvation. So when we think of salvation, we often think, justification by grace through faith, which definitely being saved as part of that having our sins forgiven, being given the gift of salvation of relationship with Jesus but the word sozo is a lot more than that, because it's a homework assignment for those who have gone to grad school or returning to grad school. Go to one of these free websites designed for people that never study, Greek or Hebrew on an academic level. Like a blue Letter Bible or the Bible hub. You can go to english with save, click on to ABC sozo and it will give you all the occurrence. All the verses are just appears on your screen and you can see the context and surrounding verses. But the homework assignment is do a word study on sozo and you will find that there are many times when it's translated, not as safe in English, but it's dealing with wholeness, healing, health, that type of thing. So, I find that word is a great encouragement to guide students because because they can see it being used in in all kinds of situation, not just in terms of leading someone to Christ and saying the sinners prayer. Right. And so that does for grad students out there calling or the secondary calling is to advance the public good and glorify God while doing it. And and the progress may be hard and difficult seasons, but if they have vision that they're being molded and shaped for something that God will use them to help us as the public good and to glorify Him.

Jon Steele  3:52  
That would be a great encouragement. So it sounds like even even the idea of stamina or keeping your eyes on the prize, that that that becomes kind of one of the big challenges as you advance further in especially some of these longer programs of why am I doing this to myself like I could have been I could have just been done years ago and already had a job making money and working towards my future. And sort of long for the days of old when life was simpler. We all do that in one way or another. But that that something that is helpful as you continue through your program is is this idea of sozo this, that God is is doing this work in you and through you that the to advance the sheep to advance the kingdom to advance human good that this is a part of what of why you are putting yourself through this rigor because you are you are a part of God's redeeming work on earth through this program and through what you're going to do afterwards.

Hon Eng  4:54  
Yeah, vision is human flourishing. And isn't a secular sacred split meaning that it is in this hierarchy where you have professional Christian ministers like missionaries and pastors and invoices, workers have a higher status and the kingdom of God. Those that are engaged in Vision is human flourishing. And isn't a secular sacred split, meaning that is in this hierarchy where you have professional Christian ministers like missionaries and pastors and voices that have a higher status in the kingdom of God and those that are engaged in corporate law investment banking.

Jon Steele  5:24  
Yes, exactly. That's a it is it does feel very easy to lose sight of that. That having the role of like the role itself of a pastor or a minister of some kind is somehow more important than fill in the blank, you know, quote unquote secular role. And to think like this, this is why we exist is to prepare other people to prepare the vast majority of people to step into a very different world than this one. And to continue this this this work of human flourishing.

Hon Eng  6:07 
Yeah, I tell a bad joke. I grew up watching Bozo the Clown. Bozo rhymes with sozo. So I say don't be a bozo. Be a sozo.

Podcast Outro – (Upbeat acoustic guitar music)

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Transcribed by https://otter.ai